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BEER AND A 20 YEAR OLD! ANYONE??????

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ScottieB64

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#41
Responses like that IS why our society is in the situation it is in. People take no responsiblity for their actions and feel the "system" is out to get them. I am a firm believer in the fact that the reason our society is the way it is is due to the lack of discipline at home beginning with the parents. When i was a kid (and that wasn't too long ago) if I did something wrong, I got my ass kicked. No questions asked. Now parents defend their kids even when they know they were wrong. The court system is full of them. I guess you are probably one of those people that criticize law enforcement for enforcing the law but when you need them, you will still call them. And you know what? I will still respond because that is my job. To protect and to serve. And that is what I do no matter who it is that calls. Sure people enforcing the law aren't above the law in any way, and we do have to make judgement calls all the time. Something I tell people when they ask why I am supposedly picking on them and didn't get the other guy is "When you go fishing don't catch all the fish everytime you go do you?" Well it is the same way with us. You just can't get everyone that is breaking the law. You have to use selective judgement. This is my last post on this subject. You are entitled to your opinions and I mine. That is why we live in a democracy. This is not the place to really discuss this anyway. I just want you to put yourself in my shoes when I have to knock on a door late at night and tell your husband, or kids, or mother, or father that your were killed in a car accident caused by a drunk driver. I am sure you have never had to do that, but let me assure you that is one of the worst feelings in the world.
 
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Sodey

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#42
I like You! But you've got me all wrong. If my kid misbehaves in school, the teacher is the least of his worries! I am an extremely tough parent! My kids are not allowed to ride in a car with another kid who has had their license less than 6 months. If I ever would catch them stealing, or doing drugs or alcohol outside of my knowledge, they are in deep trouble!

They all have cell phones and must check in with me whenever they change locations while away from home. They are not allowed to see R-rated movies unless I have seen them first.

But at the same time, I have a responsibility to produce a quality product, that being my kids so that they become productive members of society. They need to learn to think on their feet and make decisions. Everything is not black and white.

Just because your law says it is ok to commit murder (abortion) doesn't mean they should allow it as a choice for themselves.

There are good laws and bad laws. Some need interpretation. That's why I teach them how to think.

The drinking age is 21 because that is when our American Society believes a person should be able to understand how to use the drug responsibly. However some 40 year olds have never learned this responsibility. My kids are going to learn it while I as their sole provider have the power and where-with-all to make sure they understand alcohol and all the consequences of abusing it. Just saying "You can't drink unitl you are21 and out of the house" doesn't cut it. I need to know that they know what is going on. I'm not going to let their friends educate them. That's my job! And I take it seriously!
 
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DanielR2004

Guest
#43
I think it's incredibly ridiculous that sodey has to defend herself like this. She asked a simple question, and in return she gained people questioning her ability as a parent??? That offends ME when people are so close minded!

Can we only post nice positive things people? We're all adults here!

-Daniel
 
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ScottieB64

Guest
#44
I said that was going to be my last response to the subject but guess I was wrong. I am not directing all my comments at you, Sodey. That is just how I feel about the subject in general. I appreciate that you take parenting responsible whereas alot do not. I also agree that the drinking age should be lowered but I don't have the option to selectlvely enforce the laws. I just enforce them. I don't make them. In my mind, it isn't right for a person to go off and fight for our country at the age of 18 but can't come home to the land he has helped defend and not partake in a cold beer. But like I said, I don't make the laws. By no means is this a personal attack on you. We just differ in the way we see things and there is nothing in the world wrong with that. We will just have to agree to disagree.
 
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LUV2Cruz2

Guest
#48
Sodey, in Florida it is illegal for a parent or any adult to give a kid under 21 alcohol...in your home or not. It IS prosecuted here and there are parents who have gone to jail for it and their kids taken away from them.

We had another case not too long ago of a kid who was having a party and had friends over and he was serving beer and wine to the kids. His parents were there supervising, but when the party broke up, one of the kids got killed in an auto accident and his passenger who lived told the police where they were and those parents got arrested and are still in jail.
 
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aggieastrosfan

Guest
#49
That's surprising regarding the Florida and North Carolina laws.

In Texas, not only is it perfectly legal for a minor to drink in the presence of their parent or guardian, it's also legal for a "minor" to drink with their "of age" spouse.

Having waited tables when I was in college, I can vouch that it is also perfectly legal to serve a minor in a restaurant as long as their parent, guardian, or legal spouse is present. I have, however, worked at restaurants that refused to honor this, and have seen a couple walk out WITH their marriage license because I couldn't seve them due to the restaurant's policy.

If they leave the presence of their parent, guardian, or legal spouse, however, and are stopped by law enforcement officers and have a detectable presence of alcohol, THAT'S illegal.

Debate the morality of it as you will, just presenting the position that state laws are in fact different, and any family planning a land vacation within the US should definitely research laws regarding this if they're from a state such as Texas where this law is generally common knowledge.

That's why I like these boards so much, you learn something new every day!
 
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Sodey

Guest
#50
Send me one (only one!) article where a parent gave their child (and only their child) a glass of wine under their supervision and the parent was arrested! There aren't any!
I'm not talking about having a beer party for your children. I'm talking about being at home, or in a fancy restaurant (where I'm driving) or on a cruise under my supervision where I purchase a glass of wine, or a beer, or a frozen thingee for my child. Quit bringing up highway deaths and all that garbage because I'm not talking about that.

When our kids are about to turn 16, we climb into a car with them at 15 1/2 and ride with them as they learn to drive. We start of slow. I happen to start them off in a cemetery so if they lose control they can't kill anybody! Little by little we move on to the roads and then the highways and then the freeways etc...

We don't just say, "Hey you're 16 here are the keys, knock yourself out!"

But that's what we do with alcohol!

You can't have a drop in any way shape or form but once you turn 21 go into a store and buy all you want and drink all you want with absolutely no experience. How Stupid is that?!!!

You people with this "The Law is the Law crap" are part of the problem. Get real!
 
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DanielR2004

Guest
#51
I agree with sodey once again. If you give children freedom at a younger age (16, 17, 18), they wont go CRAZY when they turn 21by abusing the privilege of drinking. In Mexico and some parts of Europe, teenagers are of age to drink. So, what better way to expose your children to alcohol in a CONTROLLED environment such as in Mexico where it IS legal?

Yes, it is not right for parents to get their children "wasted" any night the children darn well choose. However, showing your children the affects of alcohol in a controlled environment so when they are in your presence is far from out of line! It's not as though they will be driving.

Let's ignore the laws for just a second... which at times can be COMPLETELY unreasonable at times (as most of us know). It's all about ethics in a situation where one's legal guardian giving a DRINK (not shots of hard liquor) just to let them know what it is like to drink.... (as if high school doesn't teach them anything).

In my community we just recently had two teenage girls die from drinking in driving (both at different times). The funeral was the saddest thing I have ever experienced in my entire adult life. This really made children aware that they are NOT invincible, and that they should make the right choices as teenagers. It opened their eyes of the affects of alcohol. Children in the community have given up drinking for this summer and are proud to assist in being a designated driver for their friends.

It's all about how you raise your children. Teach them well.

-Daniel



Post Edited (06-30-04 22:39)
 
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MrsPete

Guest
#52
I have several comments to make, and I apologize if I send them to the wrong people.

First, to many posters: The reason you're arguing about "this is the law" or "that is the law" is simple. Drinking is a STATE issue, not a federal issue; therefore, the law in NC may very well be different from the law in FL or TX. Add to that the fact that individual businesses may decide to be MORE STRICT than their state laws, if they choose. So what matters is that you know the truth for your area.

Related topic: Did you know that when all the continental states raised the drinking age to 21, Hawaii kept theirs at 18? The feds offered big-time highway funding to any state that'd raise the drinking age (because the statistics show clearly that raising the drinking age lowers the number of accidents, it's a logical connection); Hawaii wanted to keep its alcohol sales, and they don't have any roads to speak of anyway, so they chose to stay lower. I don't think that's true anymore, but it was true years ago.

VictoriaJ: Yes, I did have some bad personal experiences wtih drinking as a child. If I had not had an alcoholic father, my life would have been vastly different. I'm amazed at how many other people had similar experiences.

ScottieB64: You're exactly right. We may or may not like the law personally (I'd like to be able to drive faster and skip my taxes, but I don't have those choices), but we have to follow it. I do agree that there's a fairness issue with the "you can die for your country at 18 but not get a drink" thing; however, the answer to that issue is not breaking the law. If you disagree with the law, you can work to change it.

Everyone I knew in high school whose parents let them drink ALSO drank heavily away from their parents. As a teacher, I know many students who brag that their parents allow them to drink at home -- then they laugh about how their parents have no idea how much they're drinking away from home too. They view it as a big joke on their parents. Perhaps there are others who are quietly enjoying one glass of wine with their dinner, and they aren't bragging -- but, if so, they are in the minority.

Sodey: I disagree with your analogy about teaching your child to drive vs. just handing him a bottle at 21. Every one of us is teaching our children about alcohol from a young age THROUGH EXAMPLE. Teaching by example is soooo important. Children who grow up seeing parents behave responsibly with alcohol ARE learning, whether they themselves ever pick up a glass or not. Children whose parents say, "I don't care what the law says, you can have this" are teaching their children that it's okay to break the law.

Daniel: I have seen kids "go crazy" once they're out of their parents' homes, and I've seen kids continue to behave responsibly. And I think it's hard to predict who'll go which direction. I think it's much more complicated a question to have it boil down to drinking and curfews. I think it has to do with having instilled a sense of self-discipline within the child early on. Kids without self-discipline and a sense of moderation can go off the deep end with lots of different problem behaviors: spending money, attending college classes, over-eating. Drinking is just one detail in the grand scheme of things.

I notice that no one argued with my #1 point: the health issue. An 18 year old liver is not the same as a 25 year old liver, and there's clear evidence that kids who begin drinking early are more likely to become alcoholics.
 
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NY Eric

Guest
#55
Mrs. Pete -

I agree with several of your point but....

The health issue - An 18 yr old's live is just as functional as a 25 year old's liver. If a human isnt physically fully grown by age 18, I think something may be wrong. Now drinking is not good for any liver and I get the point, but lower your age down to 12 when the body is still growing.

Mentally - an 18 year old and a 25 year old are completely different animals.

Cheers!
Eric
 
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VictoriaJ

Guest
#56
UNBELIEVABLE!
All I did was ask a simple question 52 posts ago..Look at what a controversal subject this is..
The only reason I asked in the first place is someone told me their kid drank on RC cruises at 18...(beer & wine only)
I have to tell you that I'm back from my cruise and my daughter and I had a pina colada
on the lounge chairs on the deck...Nobody got drunk...Nobody was acting irrisponsible..
Their was also a time or two I bought her a Corona. No big deal...I liked it better this way because I could keep track of how many she had.
NOBODY got drunk, wasted, or anythinkg else. I have no problem buying my daughter a drink who will be 21 In 3 months.
 
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Vicar

Guest
#57
Victoria

That sometimes happens on these boards . One question or observation and it snowballs *LOL*

I certainly understand that this is a very controvertial subject and people do have very strong opinions on it.

I have stated earlier that yes in certain situations in which I was present (family parties, weddings , etc) I have let my 17 yr old daughter have a beer or a glass of champagne. i was right by her side , she was not driveing, and also like I said. She has rarely even finished the whole drink let alone started binge drinking and got drunk.

Would I ever host a party for her and her friends at my home and serve liqour NEVER!!!

I would not even buy her a drink in a restaurant or on cruise in public.

Everyone has different feelings on this .

When I was a baby and cutting a tooth , my grandmother dipped her finger in wine and rubbed it on my gums . When we were little and we had a bellly ache, we were given a spoonful of blackberry Brandy. When you had a bad cold you were given hot tea with a little whiskey and sent to bed to sweat it out.

All my aunts uncles and cousins were brought up this way, and there is not one degenerate drunk in the whole crowd *LOL*

It is only MHO but when you are brought up with respect for something, knowledge of the responcibilities of your actions , and a sense of moderation . Its a pretty good guide
 
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Belizemama

Guest
#58
Vicar,
You know, I haven't thought about it in a long time, but when I was small my Mom always tried to give me hot tea with honey and whiskey in it when I had a chest cold. :( As I recall, I always threw up, and begged her not to try to give it to me again. Maybe that is the answer to getting your kids to hate alcohol. Try to MAKE them drink it when they are really young and they will never want it again. :?
To this day, I can't stand any kind of hard liquor. I drink wine and a beer occasionally, but nothing harder. Hmmm? I wonder if they knew something way back then? ;)
 
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Sodey

Guest
#59
Way to go Victoria! You did exactly what I'm talking about!

Mrs Pete can try and state all her facts and figures but it will never replace good old common sense. If she wants other people to think for her so she doesn't have to, fine by me.

OH No, you could have damaged your baby's liver by putting whiskey on her gums!!!

My 13 year old's liver is shot because she's taking communion every week.
Oh what am I gonna do??

Blah, Blah, Blah!
 
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Vicar

Guest
#60
Belizemama

Could be ????

Actually the reason they used those home remedies (especially in my parents day, was because there weren't all these medicines they have today, and even if there were, In the Depression, who could afford them? So they improvised.

I don't drink hard liqour like I used to anymore . I do love a beer now and again or a glass of wine with dinner. I admit i went a bit overboard last November in NOLA , but before that , i can't even remember the last time I got totally trashed .
 
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